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Time to say goodbye...
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DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantmediadogg
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Registered: March 18, 2007
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Does the Rules Committee still exist? Are today's most prolific and dedicated contributors already members? If the answer to both is yes, maybe start with that group taking on the task?
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorDanae Cassandra
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Registered: May 26, 2007
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The Rules Committee section of the forum still exists at least.  The last post in it was in 2019.
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorrdodolak
Registered: March 18, 2007
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Quoting Danae Cassandra:
Quote:
The Rules Committee section of the forum still exists at least.  The last post in it was in 2019.


But who is on the rules committee, that is who are the voting members? Are there other individuals that are on the contribution approval committee too?
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorAddicted2DVD
Registered: March 13, 2007
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I believe we all have access... but I see a problem with this idea... with no way to update the rules on the site there is no way to enforce any of these "rules" you create. They can't be enforced since people are not required to come to the forum for these discussions and such. Nor do anyone have to agree with any decisions set by other members.

I don't personally see such a thing working without being able to change or adding to the actual site rule.
Pete
 Last edited: by Addicted2DVD
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorDanae Cassandra
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Registered: May 26, 2007
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Quoting rdodolak:
Quote:
Quoting Danae Cassandra:
Quote:
The Rules Committee section of the forum still exists at least.  The last post in it was in 2019.


But who is on the rules committee, that is who are the voting members? Are there other individuals that are on the contribution approval committee too?


Back in the day, anyone could request access to that section of the forum, and Ken/Gerri would grant it.  I don't know who all has access to it.  As far as the voting process, to quote Ken's post from 2012 there:

Quote:
To get a rule changed or added:

- Start a dedicated thread in this forum, state the problem and proposed solution.
- Discuss and build a consensus, modifying the solution as required.
- When a consensus is built, the op restates the final proposal, including proposed wording for the change
- The op opens a support ticket and links to the thread.

Note: The consensus need not be universal, but it should be as broad as possible.
If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.
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DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantmediadogg
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Registered: March 18, 2007
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Quoting Addicted2DVD:
Quote:
I believe we all have access... but I see a problem with this idea... with no way to update the rules on the site there is no way to enforce any of these "rules" you create. They can't be enforced since people are not required to come to the forum for these discussions and such. Nor do anyone have to agree with any decisions set by other members.

I don't personally see such a thing working without being able to change or adding to the actual site rule.

As as been stated before, access was granted upon approved request. I never requested, and therefore don’t have access. And I’m probably not the only one. But it doesn’t matter because I would follow the rules as amended, and if I didn’t, I would be voted down.
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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Quoting Addicted2DVD:
Quote:
I don't personally see such a thing working without being able to change or adding to the actual site rule.

I agree.  We should keep in mind that the online database is not our database, it's Invelos' database, and we should abide by the Invelos rules when contributing.  Too many contributors seem to want the online database to conform to what they want locally and push against the rules at every opportunity.  If everyone would stick to contributing uncontroversial data the database would be fine and the forums would be civil.

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 Last edited: by scotthm
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorrdodolak
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Quoting Danae Cassandra:
Quote:
- The op opens a support ticket and links to the thread.


But that part will be the issue since Invelos isn't responding to support tickets.
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorAiAustria
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Quoting Addicted2DVD:
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Nor do anyone have to agree with any decisions set by other members.

And there are users, who don't. That's the prerequiste for this thread 
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorRutan
Registered: March 14, 2007
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.

Mistake.
 Last edited: by Rutan
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantmediadogg
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Quoting AiAustria:
Quote:
Quoting Addicted2DVD:
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Nor do anyone have to agree with any decisions set by other members.

And there are users, who don't. That's the prerequiste for this thread 

Wait ... thought you were gone.    You come back and throw salt? You have just lost any credibility you might have had. And you will not admit you were wrong to badmouth the whole community.
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
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Quoting AiAustria:
Quote:
Quoting Addicted2DVD:
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Nor do anyone have to agree with any decisions set by other members.

And there are users, who don't. That's the prerequiste for this thread 

If we would stop trying to push and stretch the rules and just contribute what is clearly permissible there would be much less contention in the forums and the database would still be fine.

We shouldn't even feel the need to come to a consensus on what the rules allow.  If you don't know, don't contribute.

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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorGSyren
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Quoting scotthm:
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If you don't know, don't contribute.

That sounds reasonable, but the problem is that in this case both sides "know".
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorscotthm
Registered: March 20, 2007
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Quoting GSyren:
Quote:
Quoting scotthm:
Quote:
If you don't know, don't contribute.

That sounds reasonable, but the problem is that in this case both sides "know".

The way it appears to me is that one view is that the rules are the standard we should contribute by, and the other view is that we should go by community consensus.  My point is that we don't need a consensus as the rules cover (virtually) all necessary points.  If there is a question, don't contribute it.  It's OK if a profile doesn't contain 15 makeup credits and 50 visual effects credits.

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DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile Registrantmediadogg
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Edited: Fixed a mistake in my double negatives

Good points all around. But remember that DVD Profiler relies on a user-supported database and Invelos has implemented a semi-democratic process for moderating the contributions process and maintaining the contributions rules, that again, relies on the user community.

So, I think that in the absence of being able to execute the regular process, any alternative that seeks to preserve the same fairness and democratic principles would be acceptable to Invelos, if done in the spirit of the existing process.

That being said, here is my stake in the ground for a possible process:

(1) Develop a list of members based on the numbers of accepted contributions
(2) Create a poll open to all registered members, that collects 1 vote for the member's choice of membership on a small Contributions Review Board. The Board will decide who to name as the leader, who will control a special Forum thread for contributions disputes.
(3) After a designated length of time, the 3 people with the top number of votes, who accept the job, are named as members of the Board which will have the final say on contributions rules disputes, with the authority to make reasonable adjustments to the Invelos rules that make sense based on current conditions and current consensus
(4) Members of the community who want to make contributions will be asked to be bound by a self-imposed honor code to respect the decisions of the review board and refrain from public rebellion.
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 Last edited: by mediadogg
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Quoting mediadogg:
Quote:
Edited: Fixed a mistake in my double negatives

Good points all around. But remember that DVD Profiler relies on a user-supported database and Invelos has implemented a semi-democratic process for moderating the contributions process and maintaining the contributions rules, that again, relies on the user community.

So, I think that in the absence of being able to execute the regular process, any alternative that seeks to preserve the same fairness and democratic principles would be acceptable to Invelos, if done in the spirit of the existing process.

That being said, here is my stake in the ground for a possible process:

(1) Develop a list of members based on the numbers of accepted contributions
(2) Create a poll open to all registered members, that collects 1 vote for the member's choice of membership on a small Contributions Review Board. The Board will decide who to name as the leader, who will control a special Forum thread for contributions disputes.
(3) After a designated length of time, the 3 people with the top number of votes, who accept the job, are named as members of the Board which will have the final say on contributions rules disputes, with the authority to make reasonable adjustments to the Invelos rules that make sense based on current conditions and current consensus
(4) Members of the community who want to make contributions will be asked to be bound by a self-imposed honor code to respect the decisions of the review board and refrain from public rebellion.



Sounds like a plan that may work.
But in the spirit of the OP, I also am saying goodbye to the program. Would like to say thanks to everyone that has helped me out over the last 12 years. The plug-ins that I've used. The help on common name threads and to the people who started common name threads - I enjoyed searching the web for films to confirm credits. I've decided to retire early. Take my pension. Bought a travel trailer and am headed which ever way my vehicle is pointed. So I my pop in to check out the forums when have a chance.
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