Goblin,

What you say makes sense. However, this is a situation where logic and emotions conflict. The logical thing may be to drop the conversation, but emotionally it's very unsatisfying. And, like it or not, as human beings we are usually driven more by emotion than by logic. One might wish it wasn't so, but sadly... 

Quoting GSyren:

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Goblin,

What you say makes sense. However, this is a situation where logic and emotions conflict. The logical thing may be to drop the conversation, but emotionally it's very unsatisfying. And, like it or not, as human beings we are usually driven more by emotion than by logic. One might wish it wasn't so, but sadly... 

I know that it's hard ... and that it definitely doesn't always work out fine on the emotional basis (especially not on a "Bad Hair Day"). That's why I put in the "THINK before you write", if you do so and only half of the usually not less insulting counter attacks remain unwritten ... 

My 2cents

Aside from the true personal attacks, which should be dealt with harshly, I think the problem is thin skin.  I don't have any feelings for the people that have left.  They chose to leave on there own.  And for the people to get in a huff, and take their toys with them was really ridiculous. 

Everybody who reads the forums, knows who the problems are.  Unfortunately those people know how to push the right buttons, either intentional or not, to get under peoples skin.  Deal with it.  Most are not personal attacks, some is pure rudeness.  Most is a version of "its my way, so deal with it".

Everybody has an opinion about the rules.  Since there are many situations which the rules don't directly cover, some people think that our opinion is the only valid one.  When some people express that opinion and it is challenged directly, then for some reason some people get "offended".

As far as the forums go, I don't block anyone.  I read most of the forums, and only participate when I have something to contribute.  You will notice that this is my 550th forum post in 3 years. I can, on my own, skim past the rhetoric, and pull the information out that I need (although can be time consuming in 12 pages of posts).  I find it amazing that there are people that have 9k, 10k 16k posts.

Sometimes, the people that have been around for 10 years (not me), seem to think that they have some special knowledge or insight into the rules.  They very well may have a knowledge, from previous discussions, about certain aspects of the rules. They need to express this in a different way that is not so confrontational.  With the depth of the forums, sometimes searching can be a very tedious task.

I don't know how many versions of the rules there have been (I really don't care), I also do not know what it was like before the "rules" (I understand at times it was not pretty, but again for the current situation, I don't care).  All I know is what is here now.

We all need to get off our high horse, and quit thinking we are better than the next guy.

Charlie

Quoting Ken Cole:

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Quoting hal9g:

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I believe that it is somewhat disingenuous to suggest that a stricter moderating policy would drive people away.

That might be disingenuous, if it were what I was suggesting.  My point is that if we were to combine the strictest of policies suggested at one time or another (absolute politeness combined with a 1-strike permaban), virtually everyone would be banned.  In fact, I would likely have to ban myself.

I haven't seen anyone suggest this, so it is nothing more than hyberbole.

We need stricter enforcement, not what you are suggesting, and I know you know the difference..

Quoting CharlieM:

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I think the problem is thin skin.

Agreed 100%.  I'm not condoning rude and offensive behavior, but this is just a forum and offensive people can be ignored.

If it weren't for the thread derailments it causes, I couldn't care less about the bickering.

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Quoting goblinsdoitall:

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Quoting surfeur51:

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Quoting goblinsdoitall:

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Yes it frankly is that simple,

You will note that I named nobody with this example. The purpose was not to come back on an old story, but to illustrate what I see as something not simple at all : the same sentence may be seen differently depending on what side you are. And nobody can think that using terms like anarchist, troll, racist, even if they are "self moderated" by other considerations, will leave the receiver happy.

Surfeur,
what are you up to??
Deflecting from your own failures by accusing others?
You named nobody with your example, because you didn't have to. And I can only guess what your "purpose" was, but you came up with an old story, if you really wouldn't have wanted to, the same effect could have been reached without the example.
And implicating that I might have named you "anarchist, troll, racist" in my unmoderated post is infamy at it's best.
Neither could you, nor do you know what was originally written (an extremely sarcastic essay about the word "hypothetical" BTW). None of these are words I would use for you. The fact that some of your postings have a troll-like re-hashing sequence, still doesn't make you a troll (See I wrote it again). It's just like with a good singer, just because she can sing like a bird doesn't make her a bird.

And pleeease, stop playing the victim, I can assure you that you are widely considered to be part of the problem. Always working after the same method: First offend someone and when flak comes back hide behind your, otherwise excellent, bad English.
I've had this more than once and can't stand it anymore.
For the future, do us both a favour, simply ignore me, like I'll do with you.

EDIT: Oh and BTW Gunnar is correct, forget what I wrote earlier.

Is your response above an example of (a), (b) or (c) below? 

Quoting goblinsdoitall:

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Tried to keep myself out of here,

but some of you seem to forget that there are at least three other users who get heavily moderated. Just because these usually get moderated for (sometimes even unprovoked) attacking the already adressed user, doesn't make this any better. One of them even admits that he's trolling on purpose.

It's either all or none

This forum is, as surfeur would surely support, in wide areas an unfriendly place. This is NOT caused by a single user (how could this be) but by a whole bunch of them who seem to need a highly aggressive discussion to polish their ruffled egos. Many of them can be found in this thread, all screaming for bans.
Once more: If bans, then for all that behave inappropriate.

For those of us who care for a more friendly environment: this might help:

- If you don't have anything use- or helpful (or at least humorous) to ad to the discussion: Stay out, there will be other topics when your opinion is asked again.

- If you get attacked in a discussion you need to distinguish between:

a) attack on your opinion: This usually is OK, that's what I'd call discussion.

b) attack on your person: NOT OK, feel free to use the "Red Arrow", but under no circumstance respond to the attack, the average attack will soon stop if there's no response.

c) Don't mix up a) and b) !!

- Even though Ken stated above that politeness is not necessarily a required attribute in these forums do not adress other users in a way that you wouldn't want to be adressed.

- THINK before you write (it's not illegal yet)

- Don't ask what the Mods can do to make this a better place (except if you are a Mod), do what you can do to achieve this goal.